Valle Brembana

[goro]

Hallo,
We are group of friends from the Czech Republic, planing a ridge hike in October from Barzio or Intróbio to Pizzo dei Tre Signore, Monte Ponteranica, Passo di San Marco, Monte Fioraro, Monte Azzaredo, Monte Caddele, Passo di Dordona, Corno Stella, Monte Masoni, Monte Aga, Pizzo del Diavolo a Cima Solima, Pizzo Redorta and descend into the Valbondione. We tried to search several informations on the web, but some problems we still need to solve. Please give us advice, if you can. This will be our first journey to Italy. Thank a lot!

1. We'll arrive to Bergamo Airport on Saturday 9.Oct after 8pm. We need to get a propane gas canister for our stove (not allowed in a plane, so we need to get it after arrival). We tried to find store with outdoor equipment open on sunday, but DF Sport Specialist near Orio airport will close 15minutes before our arrival and it'll be closed on Sunday and we couldn't find any other outdoor shop in Bergamo. It's desperate situation for us:( Can we get a gas canister in some alpine hut or camp site?

2. There are some Refufio - Alpine huts on the ridge. Rif.Grasi, Benigni, Rif. Ca'San Marco., Bivaco Zamboni, ... Will these be open during a week?

3. Can we build tent in the mountains? Are there suitable places? Is it legal?

4. We have map Kompass 105 purchased (covering first part of our route), but we can't get Kompass 104 now (it's ordered and we're waiting for it), so we don't know if there is some trail on the ridge. Is it difficult to climb Pizzo Redorta, Pizzo di Coca, Pizzo del Diavolo?
Can we find any online hiking maps to survey posible routes? Or any maps scaned. It's very duficult to find it without italian language knowledge

5. Are there any springs of drinkable water on the ridge?

6. Can you recommend any other (faster, easier) approach to the top of the ridge? For now we decided to start in Barzio - Concenedo or Introbio, because there is bus going on sunday morning. If there is a better way to get onto the ridge, please give us advice. We don't mind to go reversed direction (from the east side), but we couldn't find any connections on sunday.

Thank you very much for any help.

[IW2LBR]

hello goro, wellcome on the forum of the Brembana Valley

2. There are some Refufio - Alpine huts on the ridge. Rif.Grasi, Benigni, Rif. Ca'San Marco., Bivaco Zamboni, ... Will these be open during a week?

Grassi ans San Marco huts are always open, managers live there. Rifugio Benigni in that period is open only in weekends (Saturday and Sunday). It could also be closed, due to snow conditions.

For more info, here are the contacts:
- Rifugio Grassi: +39 348 8522784 - bortoletto.anna@libero.it
- Rifugio Benigni: +39 340 7714820 - rifugiobenigni@tiscali.it
- Rifugio San Marco 2000: +39 34586020 - +39 349 8048505 - sanmarco2000@live.it

Can we build tent in the mountains? Are there suitable places? Is it legal?

On Alps Orobie there are campsites and, along the trail, wide repaired pastures; it is usually not a problem to install the tent. Only, pay attention to weather conditions, snowfalls are possible in that period.

Are there any springs of drinkable water on the ridge?

Along the "Sentiero" 101 of Orobie Alps there are many water sources : http://www.sentierodelleorobie.it

Can you recommend any other (faster, easier) approach to the top of the ridge? For now we decided to start in Barzio - Concenedo or Introbio, because there is bus going on sunday morning. If there is a better way to get onto the ridge, please give us advice. We don't mind to go reversed direction (from the east side), but we couldn't find any connections on sunday.

Coming from Orio al Serio Airport the shortest route would be Valtorta -> Piani di Bobbio -> Rifugio Grassi -> Pizzo Tre Signori - Rifugio Benigni -> Ponteranica etc. etc., but buses are not available on Sundays - we'll check for other possible solutions...

Bergamo bus station for PIAZZA BREMBANA - VALTORTA
http://ro.autobus.it/RO/asp/RicercaOrar ... bmit=cerca

bye

[andrea.brembilla]

Hi goro...I answer you for mountaineering questions:

- no problem for water, Orobie Alps have a lot of sources and streams (with good quality), and sometimes on the track you can find also some drinking fountain. Of course you have to take a flask (possibly big).

The mountains that you have mentioned are three of the most representative peaks of Orobie, and the climb is long and tiring, but I think you have a good training if you really want to do a long ridge hike like this.
So:

1 - Pizzo del Diavolo (Devil's Peak in english): not too hard but long, of course you have to use hands (climb is a word too exaggerate!), but without difficult and the track is signaled with paint on the rock. If you feel dizzy, remind that the last metres before the edge are on a small crown. Remind also that is 2.916 metres high.
It's beautiful because it seems to be a pyramid, look this:
Devil Peak bike trekking
this
Pizzo del Diavolo
and this (during winter)
Diavolo invernale

2 - Pizzo Redorta: 45' after the Baroni al Brunone Alpine Hut there is a little glacier to do, then you have to wear crampons (especially in october, when it's possible that you find new snow); after the glacier there is a little run to climb where the rock is unstable, pay attention.

3 - Pizzo Coca: it's the highest peak of Alpi Orobie (3052 metres), when you will be on the edge...the panorama in marvellous! The track is long, abrupt but without particular difficulties if you have already do the Devil's Peak and the Pizzo Redorta; it's better you sleep at Coca Alpine Hut.

[Paolo]

Hi goro & friends,

here are some more answers:


1) there's an outdoor shop inside "Oriocenter", the large shopping mall just outside the airport; on saturdays it closes at 9pm, and it's open also on sundays.
I've never been there, but I expect it to have camping gear.

4) you can find maps and descriptions of the routes on the CAI (the Italian Alpine Club) site.
Go to http://www.caibergamo.it, click on the "Sentieri" icon, then the "accedi" flag.
You can select "Cartina" to have the whole map (clickable on huts and tracks), "Voglio andare a" (I want to go to") to insert a specific site,
or one ot the "Sentieri" links to have the list of the tracks.
From the descriptions, you can access the map clicking on the "Cartina" button.
I think that with some online translator you can get a readable translations; otherwise feel free to ask here.

6) You could reach Piazza Brembana by bus (it's the last bus stop on sundays); Valtorta is at about 15km away.
There's a taxi service in Piazza Brembana (tel 0345 81343 - I don't know if the driver can speak english - it's not very likely, indeed...) which could take you to Valtorta or, better, to Valtorta/Ceresola (10 minutes by car over the village, which is where the route to rifugio Grassi starts).
Otherwise you could try with hitchhiking...


Regards,

Paolo

[goro]

Hallo,
thank you very much for your valuable advices!
There are some changes in our plan, so i'll ask you for your recommendations.

Due to bus timetables, we decides to reverse direction of our route: We'll start in Valbondione on Sunday morning (10:17 am, 10th occtober).

1) Is better to go to Rif.Curo by sent.332 (can we see the waterfalls?), then sent.323 under Pizzo di Coca - Bocch.ta del Camoscio (if there will be good weather -> reach the summit) and descent to Lago di Coca and by sent.302 to Rif.Baroni Brunone (How long this route could take?)
or
is better to go directly by sent. 301/302 to Rif.Coca. Which way is more nice?

2) We don't have crampons. How long and how dangerous is the glacier on Pizzo Redorta (via normale). Can we try it without crampons, or is better to don't go there?

3) Next day we would like to get to Bivaco Pedrinneli (Passo Publino). Sent.225 along Diavolo di Tenda (maybe summit) we will came by sent. 248 along lake Lago Diavolo, a we want to try to get on the ridge (Cima Venina --> Monte Masoni --> Pizzo Zerna --> Passo Publino). There is no numbered route, can we go this way? Or is it more climbing than walking?

4) Next day, we want to get to Bivacco Zamboni. Still follow sent.101 to Baita Pessoli, Baita della Croce, Laghi di Porcile -> Passo di Tartano.
Is better to continue by sent.101 along il Baitone, Forc.Rossa, Lago Cavizzola --> Bivacco Zamboni,
or
is possible to go ridge hike over the Cimma di Lemma, Passo di Lemma, traverz along M.Azzaredo --> Bivacco Zamboni?

5) Last part of route we need to advice is between Passo San Marco --> Passo Salmurano. Is better to follow sent.101 along M.Avaro, or can we try to go ridge hike via Monte Ponteranica, Monte Valleto? We preffer ridge hike, but not sure, if there is good way.

6) We expected, that alpine huts will be closed, so we have tents. I read
http://www.bergamonews.it/valli/articolo.php?id=19848
about some winter rooms, can we use them in case of bad weather? Do we need any allowance or key if hut is closed?
We think about stay first night (from sunday to monday) in Rif. Baroni al Brunone. It's closed on sunday evening, isn't it?

7) Last day (thursday 14th oct) we would like to go by bus from Ornica 9:15 am --> Bergamo 10:40. There is a symbol of a phone in timetable - can we use this bus? Can we order the bus from mountains by a cellular phone, or can we order bus by email ?

8) The biggest problem is still a propan gas canister for our stoves. I tried to call outdoor shop "Universo sport" (in Orio center next to airport), they said they don't sell any gass canisters :( Also iper hypermarket don't sell it.
I'm desperated at it! We dont want to wait all sunday in Bergamo city to get a gas :(
Please, if you have ANY IDEA, how we can get gas bottle, please advice us!

Thank you very much!
Bretislav Fiala
Olomouc
the Czech Republic

[Paolo]

1) Is better to go to Rif.Curo by sent.332 (can we see the waterfalls?), then sent.323 under Pizzo di Coca - Bocch.ta del Camoscio (if there will be good weather -> reach the summit) and descent to Lago di Coca and by sent.302 to Rif.Baroni Brunone (How long this route could take?)
or
is better to go directly by sent. 301/302 to Rif.Coca. Which way is more nice?

The longer, the nicer, obviously... :-)
For 310/302 the official time is 3hrs, but it can take much less, if you are a good walker (with a light rucksack, though):it's steep, but not too long.
332 + 323 (official) times are 3.30h + 4.30h, definitely a lot of time, especially if you will leave from Valbondione after 10 am.
Also, 323 is very steep, and it is usually walked in the other direction.
You could choose sent. 303 instead of 323, so you could save 1.30h (the altitude is much lower, and it's shorter, too).
The waterfalls are open 5 days a year, and one of the days is Oct 10th (lucky boys...!) , from 11 to 11.30 am, so you will be able to see them.

2) We don't have crampons. How long and how dangerous is the glacier on Pizzo Redorta (via normale). Can we try it without crampons, or is better to don't go there?

The glacier is easy enough, but once you get to the top you have two possible routes, and both of them are problematic: one is quite dangerous, the other one usually requires crampons.

3) Next day we would like to get to Bivaco Pedrinneli (Passo Publino). Sent.225 along Diavolo di Tenda (maybe summit) we will came by sent. 248 along lake Lago Diavolo, a we want to try to get on the ridge (Cima Venina --> Monte Masoni --> Pizzo Zerna --> Passo Publino). There is no numbered route, can we go this way? Or is it more climbing than walking?

Yes, you can go from Monte Masoni to Pizzo Zerna. You have to descend inside the (?)channel on the NW side of Masoni, just beyond the small wooden cross on the top, then you can try to reach Pizzo Zerna along the ridge (but be careful, the rock is very brittle); otherwise you can walk on the rocks just below the summit of Pizzo Zerna, and reach the path which will take you to bivacco Pedrinelli in 5 minutes.

4) Next day, we want to get to Bivacco Zamboni. Still follow sent.101 to Baita Pessoli, Baita della Croce, Laghi di Porcile -> Passo di Tartano.
Is better to continue by sent.101 along il Baitone, Forc.Rossa, Lago Cavizzola --> Bivacco Zamboni,
or
is possible to go ridge hike over the Cimma di Lemma, Passo di Lemma, traverz along M.Azzaredo --> Bivacco Zamboni?

Never been there - waiting for advice from the other trekkers...

5) Last part of route we need to advice is between Passo San Marco --> Passo Salmurano. Is better to follow sent.101 along M.Avaro, or can we try to go ridge hike via Monte Ponteranica, Monte Valleto? We preffer ridge hike, but not sure, if there is good way.

You can go along mt. Colombarolo, Ponteranica (some tricky passages), walk around Valletto on its north face, in Val Gerola, then climb back to Passo Salmurano; otherwise you can walk down to Pescegallo lake, then to Passo Salmurano. Both are much longer than the usual 101, though, and if you choose the first option we should give you some more advice about where to descend to walk around Valletto (there's no trail).

6) We expected, that alpine huts will be closed, so we have tents. I read
http://www.bergamonews.it/valli/articolo.php?id=19848
about some winter rooms, can we use them in case of bad weather? Do we need any allowance or key if hut is closed?
We think about stay first night (from sunday to monday) in Rif. Baroni al Brunone. It's closed on sunday evening, isn't it?

The winter rooms are always open, when the huts are closed, and you will need no allowance or key.
And yes, Rif. baroni does close on sunday evening.

7) Last day (thursday 14th oct) we would like to go by bus from Ornica 9:15 am --> Bergamo 10:40. There is a symbol of a phone in timetable - can we use this bus? Can we order the bus from mountains by a cellular phone, or can we order bus by email ?

Yes, you should call the day before to order the bus, at the toll-free number 800 18 00 48; I suggest you to try and contact them in advance at info@bergamotrasporti.it, just to be sure that you will reach someone who can speak english, and maybe to ask for a landline number (not sure that you can call the toll-free number from your mobile).

8) The biggest problem is still a propan gas canister for our stoves. I tried to call outdoor shop "Universo sport" (in Orio center next to airport), they said they don't sell any gass canisters :( Also iper hypermarket don't sell it.
I'm desperated at it! We dont want to wait all sunday in Bergamo city to get a gas :(
Please, if you have ANY IDEA, how we can get gas bottle, please advice us!

There's a camping site in Valbondione, and they sell gas canisters - but I tried to contact them, and they sell only 25 kg ones (I'm afraid it's a little too much for your needs... :-) ).
Otherwise there are some sport shops in Clusone (where the bus to Valbondione should stop), but I think that it will stop too short to allow you to look for them.
If you any have no other idea, and you will be staying in an hotel close enough to the center of Bergamo on your arrival, I could leave a gas canister at their reception (assuming you can contact and persuade them to accept it...).


Regards,

Paolo

[goro]

The waterfalls are open 5 days a year, and one of the days is Oct 10th (lucky boys...!) , from 11 to 11.30 am, so you will be able to see them.

Great, we're looking forward!
So which route form Valbondione is better for the best view of waterfalls? 305 or 332? According to map, it seems 332 leads directly under waterfalls..

332 + 323 (official) times are 3.30h + 4.30h, definitely a lot of time, especially if you will leave from Valbondione after 10 am.
Also, 323 is very steep, and it is usually walked in the other direction.

I see. We can't manage to reach Pizzo Coca summit and arrive to Rif. Baroni Brunone in the same day. So either we skip climbing on P.Coca or we will have to stay at Rif.Coca (or near) overnight. Is it correct?

Actually i dont know these mountains and i'm planing our journey only according maps, so i exactly don't know which parts of Orobie mountains (or which summits) worth to see at the most. Originally I wanted to walk through all the ridge, but now i see, we must choose some parts only.
I will be very glad for any recommendation, which routes leads through the most beautiful sceneries :)

The glacier is easy enough, but once you get to the top you have two possible routes, and both of them are problematic: one is quite dangerous, the other one usually requires crampons.

Aha.. So could we return down by the same way?

There's a camping site in Valbondione, and they sell gas canisters - but I tried to contact them, and they sell only 25 kg ones (I'm afraid it's a little too much for your needs... :-) ).
Otherwise there are some sport shops in Clusone (where the bus to Valbondione should stop), but I think that it will stop too short to allow you to look for them.
If you any have no other idea, and you will be staying in an hotel close enough to the center of Bergamo on your arrival, I could leave a gas canister at their reception (assuming you can contact and persuade them to accept it...).

25kg is really to much for us :)) We need the most common type of gas cartridge (EN417: Primus, GoSystem, Brunton, Coleman...)
In Clusone we will stop for 10 minutes. If there would be some chance of getting a cartridge on sunday, we could try to get there sooner, maybe on saturday evening already.

Today i spoke with DF-Sport-Specialst shop in Bergamo. They sell it, but they will close shop 15 minutes before our arrival and they can't help :((

We're not stying in a hotel (we originally wanted to reach backcountry and stay in a tent), but of course we are willing to go anywhere in Bergamo (or in Albino, or Valbodione...), if anyone will be able to help us with getting gas cartrigdes.

Also i tried to contact Rif.Curo and Coca, if they could help, but i didn't get any response up to now.
We'll hope and see

[franchì]

Hey, I live in Albino and I have an uncle who run an agriturismo in Fiumenero, 4 km. before Valbondione.
If you post a pic or a link where I can see the gas tank you need, I can search where you guys can buy it or I can easily get it for you and leave it somewhere along your trip to Valbondione.
About your hike, if you want to watch the falls, you should consider to stop at rifugio Coca after being at rif. Curò.
If you want to reach Pizzo Coca, the best is to leave early in the morning so you are up to the top around noon; this way you don't risk the afternoon fog and you have the time to go down and reach a rifugio or plant your tent in some nice area.
If you wait for the waterfalls at noon you will be still at 1000m. with all the road ahead of you.
Let me know

[goro]

Hey, I live in Albino and I have an uncle who run an agriturismo in Fiumenero, 4 km. before Valbondione.
If you post a pic or a link where I can see the gas tank you need, I can search where you guys can buy it or I can easily get it for you and leave it somewhere along your trip to Valbondione.

Franchì, That's great!
We need 2 peices of this:
http://www.decathlon.it/IT/cartuccia-msr-250-68614818/
or this
http://www.bikesportadventure.com/produ ... rimus.html

Also Brunton, Gosystem, VAR, ... whatever with this thread: http://www.lindalgroup.com/en.product.php?id=6

We will be in Albino on saturday evening (arriving by T1 tramway somewhen after 21pm) and sunday morging (leaving by bus 8:35 to Valbondione).
Collect gas cartridges in Albino would be the best for us